Subject Re: [Firebird-Java] thin jdbc-2 only (Re: Jdbc 2.0 Patches)
Author David Jencks
On 2002.05.21 18:18:53 -0400 rrokytskyy wrote:
> Hi,
> > Well, since we want to potentially support many isolated programs
> > running within a single JVM (using Jakarta Avalon Phoenix) on
> > potentially very small devices (ie wearable computers in hospital
> > setups) somewhere in the future, "slim" is still an issue. We're
> > still evaluating whether even basic JDBC is an option in that
> > case...

I don't know anything about Phoenix, what does it do? You might look into
writing your programs as mbeans running in a jmx container. JBoss is
essentially a collection of mbeans providing various services that when
combined result in a j2ee app server. One of our goals is to fit into tiny
devices (we're hoping for a zaurus soon). You might find some of the
services useful. Apparently jmx will be part of jdk 1.5.
> If we are talking about very small devices (small in meaning of
> available RAM, not size), I would go for another architecture. Small
> devices tend to cluster together into very big groups and access the
> same resource at the same time, and I doubt that Firebird will
> survive 1,000 simultaneous connections. If I were chief architect I
> would go for something similar to Ninja project (Jini and e-speak are
> competitors).

I agree. I think direct jdbc access from a small or numerous device is
highly inadvisable. I think communicating more specific structured
information with an app server is considerably more plausible. Remember,
JBoss is free, and the jca support was written with jboss in mind. (this is
a different use of jboss than I mentioned above)
> > Nevertheless, KISS and other principles suggest the right
> > granularity of components is important. From looking at package
> > structure, it seemed to me there could be something important to
> > gain in refactoring. Glad to have that cleared up.
> Refactoring is needed. I'm do like principle of agile/XP methods,
> saying refactor whenever possible. But in my opinion, now only very
> limited refactoring is possible.

Won't someone please stop complaining and make a specific suggestion
together with an argument about why it is an improvement! Whining is
cheap, but I have yet to see any proposal that says "doing x will result in
simplification y". I've only seen various parts of "I don't want to look
at the code, but I do want to do z, but I won't tell you why". At least
Blas has said something fairly specific about what he wants to do, and
obviously has read all the code, but I still haven't figured out why he
wants these changes.

> > One thing I can see needs a little work is some docs to explain
> > interdependencies between JDBC and JCA drivers (and why this is not
> > bad).

Reading the jca spec I think is a reasonable place to start to understand

> >
> > thought one: how do I volunteer to add some of that? (where do the
> > patches go?)
> Just raise your hand :). Then write some code/docs and post it either
> here or directly to one of developers (currently David Jencks,
> Alejandro Alberola Arias, me and Blas Rodriguez Somoza). We would be
> happy to commit it into CVS. If you contribute regularly or will
> contribute regularly, you will get CVS write access.
> > thought two: what kind of documentation system do you use/wish to
> > use? (should everything be in the javadoc??)
> David Jencks created documentation guidelines, they are available
> somewhere in Developer's corner/Firebird documentation/Tools section
> on the Firebird's site (
> op=devel&sub=doc&id=development#tools).
> In general, it is XML file, where all formatting is done using tags.
> We will use XSL to transform it into printable format.

I cribbed this from the jboss free docs project, and still like it,
although the jboss docs seem to be moving to word format :-((((.

It's docbook xml. I edit it using emacs + psgml, and the html and pdf is
generated from the xml using various stylesheets and apache FOP (for pdf).
Check out the manual module, it includes a build system and all the
stylesheets, and one lone chapter.

Another lighter possibility is to write up some more info for the website,
directly in html.

Anyway, all this interest is very encouraging, it seems that this work may
be turning out to be useful and used.

david jencks

> Best regards,
> Roman Rokytskyy
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